Cyberhorse Form outtage
 

For those wondering what happened to the form files from Cyberhorse.
Bill has said that the server crashed and corrupted the database.
I believe this ocurred yesterday, so no form for yesterday or the weekend.
Don't know how long it's going to take to be rebuilt properly, but they are going to get a backup, and then of course all the new form loaded.

Could take quite some time :(

Sorry guys, I found out last night, but had to be out early this morning and only just returned home.

Re. his backup regime, I have been with Cyber from the very first and when he had his earliest data corruption years ago he asked us to help out and upload the zipfiles if we kept it.

I think if I as a individual punter can keep my backups up to date it should be mandatory for him to have one of several backup drives ready to slot in. One back-up drive for a business like his is no backup.

Lucky I'm using other sources too.

From what I can gather his database is hosted by his isp, so it's not his drive failing, he has to upload his backup to his isp, imagine how long that would take!
Isp's generally only have one backup, so if their server crashes, backup and real data gone, they're not going to fish around in old drives to reupload it, because it's of no consequence to them.
This is another reason I will not put anything on the Cloud, and use a raid configuration server at home. If it crashes, hot swap a drive, if it's corrupted, restore from an image file.

Many major worldwide companies are very sorry they ever heard of the Cloud, including Amazon.com. All my previous companies went offsite to the Cloud and they regularly ring me for help. Sorry, can't help them!

Cloud was pushed on us early on and been touted as the best thing since sliced bread.

My boss is fairly old fashioned if one can say that about an IT guy and after some trial and eval. he decided it's not for us.

I heard some horror stories too, but regardless it seems to work for others, good luck to them I say.

Still no form, and still no word. :(
It's looking bleak for the weekend.

Yep I'm an old fashioned IT guy, there have been numerous reports of hackers accessing the Cloud. Most companies have credit card numbers, full personnel details including bank account details, trust and business account details etc etc and all the information a hacker would need to set up several clone identities and use those identities to siphon funds.Just recently a number of companies including Adobe and Racing Post have emailed me to say they had security breaches and although it's encrypted, a hacker has all the time in the world to work it out, once he's downloaded all the data. Happened to Betfair accounts also.

Cloud may be good for hosting unimportant files like iTunes music, but confidential and banking details is asking for trouble. Also most companies trust Microsoft to have uncorrupted backups, I know of a few ocassions where the backups were corrupted and all company information was lost forever!
Going to be loads of fun come Tax time!!!

Tatsbet was also very suspiciously slow last week for a number of days at off peak times.

I fear my suspicions (backup) are confirmed.
Never be without a plan B and C.
As someone here mentioned, all you need fall behind is to miss a good winner, and none of us need any help with that. Doubly painful when it's out of your control.

I am only just starting to use a cloud server from Amazon, main reason is i am able to upload my excel and Gruss software and run it with no issues, since i am no longer fully set up it makes sense to me and at a nice cost as i only run it when i need to.

I can use remote desktop from my tablet with out issues so i don't even need to buy a windows tablet if i need to run some software when away from home, so they can be useful but agree on backups, as i don't use a data base or anything heavy i just have a 4 bay usb3 hard drive storage unit and run 2 3gig drives in mirror.

You've got a very smart setup Shaun.
Cloud has it's uses, like you say for hosting and remote access etc.
Keeping a backup of data on the Cloud is also useful, just wouldn't run a large corporation or put bank account or payroll details on it.

Still no word and no files on Cyberhorse, not even a posting on their site that I can see. :(

The thing that annoys me is that there hasn't been a single word from C****e. Not a scintilla of explanation/apology to clients. Nothing. NO response to emails, their telephone is off the hook.

I've had enough and won't be re-subscribing. I'll write off the balance of my subscription to experience/tax and go elsewhere.

It wouldn't be so bad if there was some indication of progress, lack of progress.
I can wear it if they say not until next month, but not knowing any timeframe is a bit inconvenient.

I have to say i love the fact android has a RDT program that works, there is a Microsoft app but it blows, i even installed it on my phone, i won't do any hard core excel programming but i can monitor everything and i have an On/Off switch on my sheet just in case.

Yes, it is a sure-fire way to lose clients to not give them any info on what is happening. Seriously, they are in the "information" business and this does nothing to develop trust with clients. There is always Racenet and RISA. I guess this just means that I can have a little holiday from punting until I get used to one of these 2 sites formats.

The phone is off the hook and they aren't answering emails, and I received an invoice for subscription for next month with no mention about the outage at all.
On their own forums, nobody is answering queries either.

The longer this goes on, the more I think the backups don't work and that any future form may be compromised.

The whole thing is a real worry at the moment. If backups are there, should take no more than 24 to 48 hours to have it running and that's being very generous.

Obviously the "ACCOUNTS" department isn't suffering the same fate.

Cheers.

Hate to say I told so, but this easy going attitude towards backup was there from the word go.

As you said even if you have to buy a new server box and stick in the backup drives, it shouldn't take more than a day or two.

I personally would swallow my pride and buy the most current data again, it's available from various vendors.
Then they can worry about archived data.

My fear is the same as yours, the data was full of errors when they changed the system a couple of years ago, God knows what will be like this time?

even though i only used the 3 start form and web scraped that it used to be a bitch to code around the errors.

On second thought, there must be some other problem there we are not aware of.
I mean it would have been easy enough to just post the current forms!?

I heard there was a RISA issue this week? Maybe not related

I don't think they can post the current form, it's more than likely an SQL database with past runs for horses. They link the tracks table, the nominations table and the past run tables to provide the stats and the 5 start or 10 start form. Therefore having the race fields and no other tables, all the career stats and past form will be missing. I may be wrong, but this would explain why it's taking so long, especially if all the links and queries have to be rebuilt. If it's all lost, it may not be back online for weeks, it's a massive job to code it all and then test it and then upload all the data.

Although it's automated, I was offended to receive a renewal invoice, and going by past experiences, I doubt whether there will be any type of discount or allowance for days missed.The least they could have done is to add a note stating when it's expected to be fixed or even an apology we don't know how long it will take.

The stats must be derived as I outlined, because when there is a missing run or 1998 data without full past runs, the stats are incorrect.
So if or when it comes back, it would be prudent to doublecheck all horses to make sure the stats are updated and match past data plus one run.

I think their isp crashed, but can't believe they have no mirror backups to re upload, surely in this day and age when it's a business with hundreds of subscribers....

As I suspected, just got email from them

"We wish to advise on progress resolving our current service outage.

The problem was caused by a database corruption arising from a server meltdown at our web site hosting company 10 days ago.

We have been rebuilding the form database since then but have had difficulties with corrupted backups.
We believe that we have now identified all these problems and are now in the final stages of creating a new up-to-date database.
We hope to resume normal service early next week.

Sincere apologies to all our clients for this interruption to your service.
When service resumes all subscribers will have 1 month added to their subscription to compensate for the service outage."

Pretty good of them to add a month.

received same and good on them but still an early reply and update would've been welcome.

No financial loss on my part as far as wagering goes, I have a second data supplier as well different service but includes the form, but the extra month is welcome.

hopefully they'll be back on line soon

I'm led to believe it's all bad news. Words like "administration" and "debts" are being bandied about with little prospect of resumption of normal service.

Might be a good time to seek out an alternative data supplier.

Well, it's very strange there's been no update on progress as the form was supposed to be available early this week. I think it's worse than we thought.

Funny you should mention it CP I was thinking last night that the extra month extension isn't such a generous offer after all.

I think they will suffer for this mishap because dedicated punters looked elsewhere by now.

This is all very strange, no zip files a week after the expected fix, no update on progress, and it appears the site has gone very very quiet, with no posts anywhere from admin.

I fear that demodocus could be correct, but if not, most clients would have gone elsewhere by now anyway, so resumption of service now, would really be too late to make it worthwhile anyway.

Just saying.

Just found out that the news is not good.
Please read the entire extract

https://connectonline.asic.gov.au/R...e=1b3bom9tyo_22

There could be charges for trading while insolvent and a copy of the email containing mistruths shall be forwarded to the Liquidator. This is actually fraudulent, asking for subscriptions.
The database actually had nothing to do with it!

Wow.

I was not a subscriber but those documents were lodged a month ago.

Crazy stuff.

I wonder if there is any connection with the thread above this one by Rinconpaul.


Enjay

I never begrudge people for accessing free data, if it's offered take it.
But I resented the fact that some of us had to pay to access the same as what was offered free.

Either you run a business or a charity.

Correction we didn't "have" to pay.

I was using the cyberhorse form to drop into excel to help me play around with doing ratings or checking ideas and backtesting stuff. Look's like I won't be doing that anymore and will have to find a new source although i've had a look around and can't really find anything as easy to use with the same level of detail as cyberhorse and that has the form backdated as well.

If anyone is aware of something similar that can be imported into excel i'd be very grateful. Highly unlikely these guys will be back up and running given administrators look to have been appointed.

Hi All,

After speaking with liquidators office this morning of Cyberhorse Pty Ltd, I can confirm the following:

1. The petitioning creditor was the Australian Taxation Office whom are owed ~ $181,500;

2. On or about 1 day prior to the appointment of the court appointed liquidator, the assets of Cyberhorse Pty Ltd, in particular things such as the customer lists, domains, email addresses, phone numbers, subscriber lists etc were sold to another company Cyberhorse Bloodstock Pty Ltd which is a related party. The liquidator as part of their investigations is looking into the sale of the business to ensure that it was at fair market value.

The good news for Cyberhorse clients is that there may well be a resurrection of the service so that those affected can continue to receive what they have paid for.

Thanks for the update Paul

Not in this lifetime.
Racing Victoria has pulled out all funding for the Racehorse Outplacement program.
Bill has failed to advise clients of the truth of the matter, I refer to his email stating the reason for the problem.
Cyberhorse Bloodstock will have to have new Directors, and if the previous Director has any connection whatsoever, I'll not be rejoining.
You cannot sell a business to yourself to avoid a tax debt. It is highly illegal and then start again, otherwise everyone in trouble would do it.
You cannot take subscribers money whilst insolvent, that is fraudulent.
My receipt and invoice does not state it is Cyberhorse Bloodstock at all.
Bill will not repond to emails, phone calls, nor posts on his own forum.
Ergo, this tells the story better than I.

Hi CP,

I'm not defending Bill nor Cyberhorse, but simply reporting the facts as they are.

Whether or not there is a legitimate insolvent trading claim, the question is who is going to fund the liquidator to investigate any allegations?

I can also now confirm that I have been advised that the director of Cyberhorse Bloodstock Pty Ltd (CB) is in fact Bill also. As previously flagged and as part of the liquidators investigation, they will look further into the sale of the business assets. If their investigations reveal that they were sold at fair market value then that is where it ends as far as that component of their investigation is concerned. If it wasn't sold at what the liquidator deems to be fair market value then they will either ask Bill to pay more for it or alternatively they can void the sale and seek another buyer whom is willing to pay fair market value. Given the consideration for the acquisition by CB was a relatively small amount of cash with the balance being in the form of an assumption of liabilities of creditors only time will tell. I am also told that as a result of the sale, the subscribers to Cyberhorse are now creditors of CB not Cyberhorse. In that context, I am simply hoping for a favorable outcome for those affected.

Whatever happens I've written off the remaining portion of my sub, about $250.

Looking elsewhere.
 

I think the cause is lost. If it was coming back I think we would know something by now. Is there any other sites that have form available.

where to now?
 

any idea where i can access alternative data.

if you mean free then Sky form is there, not as comprehensive as Cyber used to be but adequate.


Quite a few paid ones, can I mention them here?

I use Wizard. An other one is promoted by NY. of PP fame.