Partypooper,

Yes, I know what you mean about the trip

This old boy has learned some new tricks though. I'm not for one second becoming a "trader" per se, but there are ways of further leveraging the odds in your favour.

Imagine for a moment that every second place bet you had was a free bet, or even a no risk bet, how would that improve your bottom line?

Effectively, you can get better odds by leveraging your position. The odds actually stay the same, but you've had a hundred dollar bet and it only cost you $50.00 for the same return, or you had a bet that cannot lose whichever horse wins.

By taking advantage of the swings in markets, you can green up and be a bookie, so you win a percentage no matter what the outcome is.

When playing with this though, you must have a stop loss in place....something I learned the hard way

I am using this in conjunction with another method to boost profits, and apart from lessons learned, it's working very well indeed.

I also have another wee trick up my sleeve, when I get beaten by laying a favourite, I lay it next time out....invariably I get my money back over the many favourites that don't win the second time. Only a handful win and the one's that do are pretty much shorter odds

__________________
RaceCensus - powerful system testing software.
Now with over 400,000 Metropolitan, Provincial and Country races!
http://www.propun.com.au/horse_raci...ng_systems.html
*RaceCensus now updated to 30/04/2024
Video overview of RaceCensus here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W821YP_b0Pg

Chrome

I've tweaked the market refresh rate on Fairbot to less than a second. That really helps with predicting the swings - you can see the momentum build with money being matched and added to each side of the ledger. The quicker the money moves the faster the price changes. It's particularly evident on the UK markets with the huge liquidity over there.

__________________
Pixie

"It's worth remembering that profit isn't profit until it's spent off the racecourse." -- Crash

Poop, yes you can get you pants pulled down on occasion. I'm really a lay'em and be done with it bloke, but as Chrome says there are some very real advantages to playing both sides.

__________________
Pixie

"It's worth remembering that profit isn't profit until it's spent off the racecourse." -- Crash

My personal opinion, is that running around chasing a slim profit, means that one mistake can cost you a whole day or week's work. This is why I don't like conventional trading. You can put stop losses into place, but then you're only getting a certain loss on occassions.

The snipping of slim margins means a lot of work for little reward.

However, where this comes into it's own, is when you have back or lay bets already matched in the market and the opposing price is in front of you at no risk.

That's where the additional benefit is, at no risk.

This basically means that if I back every favourite at Bookies prices, and the price comes in, I turn a small profit, already. If the price comes in and I cement a no loss situation, the odds further turn in my favour.

More favourites win when the price comes in, than out....but the odds are worse, therefore I'm making a no risk profit more often, than when the price drifts. I just have to ensure I make at least enough on each trade to counter the losing bets.

__________________
RaceCensus - powerful system testing software.
Now with over 400,000 Metropolitan, Provincial and Country races!
http://www.propun.com.au/horse_raci...ng_systems.html
*RaceCensus now updated to 30/04/2024
Video overview of RaceCensus here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W821YP_b0Pg

I have changed to Bettrader Pro which is free with the grid interface.
There are lots of entertaining demo videos.

I've come across a much safer trading angle, as anyone who trades might notice that some markets are volatile and the flow of money is often bogus money put up to drive the prices in the wanted direction and then the money is cancelled!

Ever had a trade go radically or even partially against you?

A stop loss can counter this, but so often the stop loss is triggered, and you lock in a loss, only to see the price go in the direction you wanted seconds later.

So you start to trade again, but again you get caught.

This doesn't have to happen too often to subtract from all profits previously made.

My amended strategy is to pick an overall movement, that is almost guaranteed (well kind of) to occur.

Instead of trading for one or two ticks profit, you can trade up to 10 ticks.....nice.

Here's the outline of how I'm doing it with great success recently.

Disclaimer: You must trade small amounts, and only in the last 5 minutes of the race (especially in low liquidity races).
You must also only trade to back first, and lay later. The exposure of getting caught out on lays is too great. At least with a back bet left in the market, you risk one unit only.

1. With five minutes to go, check out the odds on the favourite (must be a clear favourite) with the online bookmakers. Take no notice of the fluctuations, only the last price being offered.

2. Go to Betfair and compare the odds on the favourite. If the favourite is showing greater than 10% better on price, back it.

3. Place a corresponding Lay bet at the bookies price plus 10%.

4. If the price doesn't get matched within a few seconds of race start, cancel it and take the next best lay price, providing it is below your back price. If it isn't ....let the bet ride!

5. If it gets matched, hedge the profit for no risk (green up).

Example: Murray's Son R9 Forbes was showing $3.00 with the online bookies and was trading @ $4.10 on Betfair. As it was over $3.30 I placed a back bet @ $4.10.

I placed a corresponding lay bet @$3.30 which was matched with a minute to go, (the price actually went to $3.05 just before they jumped).

The result...0.70c for every dollar invested, profit.

You'll be amazed how often this occurs, and when it doesn't go your way, you have a bet riding at least 10% higher than online bookmakers prices....

Give it a shot

__________________
RaceCensus - powerful system testing software.
Now with over 400,000 Metropolitan, Provincial and Country races!
http://www.propun.com.au/horse_raci...ng_systems.html
*RaceCensus now updated to 30/04/2024
Video overview of RaceCensus here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W821YP_b0Pg

Oh yes Chrome I hear what you are saying alright, but it's not for me, somehow I would come a cropper I just know it!!

Chrome

Did you have any trouble downloading the BetTrader?
3 days of trying, 3 days of emails between James of Racing Traders and myself, 3 days of errors, 3 days of trying different things, and still I can't get it to work. What's worst of all is the 3 days of a mate telling me how much it's making him.

Mark,

I just tried and redownloaded it fine.
What error are you getting?

Download it from the racing traders website.

It is by far the best tool out there (for me).
The options are hugely valuable, but it is also the most complex to get knowledge of, however, they have over 120 online videos.

I've used fairbot, bet angel and a few others, but this is something head and shoulders above the rest.

It will place your orders at prescheduled times, stop loss, bookmaker feature, and numerous other features like global fill or kill and timer bets. The money indicators are superb. You can see in a blink of an eye the total matched on the event, the total matched on the horse and the actual last traded price.

There may be better products out there, but for what I do, it's brilliant.

I get nothing by recommending it - I use the free version with the grid interface, as that's all I need.I don't trade for one or two ticks profit like a lot of the guys, I trade on the overall flow of money.

If one horse decreases in price, four others will increase

If you still can't get it Mark, I'll upload it to my site for you. It's the free version (demo) but has all the features, just not the ladder, so I'm not breaching any copyright, in fact I'm sure they'd like me to do it for you.

__________________
RaceCensus - powerful system testing software.
Now with over 400,000 Metropolitan, Provincial and Country races!
http://www.propun.com.au/horse_raci...ng_systems.html
*RaceCensus now updated to 30/04/2024
Video overview of RaceCensus here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W821YP_b0Pg

Download it here

Tested and downloaded fine.

P.S. Mark, I'm sure your aware, that if you got the best price offered on every horse in the field the over round is 130%. If you got the average, the over round is 117%

__________________
RaceCensus - powerful system testing software.
Now with over 400,000 Metropolitan, Provincial and Country races!
http://www.propun.com.au/horse_raci...ng_systems.html
*RaceCensus now updated to 30/04/2024
Video overview of RaceCensus here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W821YP_b0Pg

thanks chrome ..i had a little vvideo tour and had a look at the hedging..the guy made it look like like money for jam ,surely it couldnt be that easy??..so if anybody who uses that tool cant lose it does it all for you ...must be a catch somewhere or does it cost 20000 to buy??